Thank you for this article. Really. I have a friend who is taking Community College courses, and she has become enamored with her A&P instructor who describes himself as "mostly vegan". He has almost convinced her that a piece of beef takes 4 days to digest.

I attended a college that actually taught people the facts, with no personal agenda included. We did the experiments (beef and broccoli) with hydrochloric acid at the same ph as the stomach, and lo and behold, the meat actually broke down faster than the broccoli.

If vegetarians want to be taken seriously they have to stop using this argument.

In reply to Jenna: I tried to look up this Peter R. Cheeke. It seems he is quoted quite a bit by vegans. I could not find the original source for the quote supposedly made by him. I would like to see the list of these 'studies' that he says show correlations* between meat consumption and colon cancer. I wish to examine the data myself to see whether the authors of said studies used observational or clinical data. If observational, the data is practically useless due to confounding variables. Population studies are especially vulnerable to error in that researchers will find what they want to find (confirmation bias).

Don't believe me? Look up "Lies, Damn Lies, and Medical Science". It's an excellent article that deals with pervasive dishonestly in the medical research community. You're trusting these people with your life?

Anyway, back to colon cancer studies. Rich countries eat more factory farmed meat than poor countries. Rich countries eat more refined carbohydrates, especially sugars, than poor countries. Rich countries get more colon cancer.

In data collection, researchers sometimes combine red meat with processed meat, and we should be able to guess that processed meats (the stuff eaten in sandwiches and on pizzas) will then come with several servings of white wheat flour. And those sandwiches and pizzas get washed down with HFCS containing drinks. So... is it the natural plain red meat that is to blame? Or could it be the confounding variables of wheat, sugar, or even preservatives and industrial seed oils? Unless you have actually read the study and know what variables the researchers were looking for (and ignoring), you really don't know anything at all.

* Correlation does not prove causation. Correlation does not prove causation. Correlation does not prove causation!!!

why did the Buddhist coroner get fired?

because he kept listing the cause of death as "Birth"

Thanks JS for your assiduous attention and answers - lotsa good stuff in the comments as well as the articles--

Read "Protocols of Zion" 16th Century. It states its influence on factual an nonfactual information, and how we will be misinformed; 10 false articles published to 1 article of truth. Follow the money... Also check out the Documentary "THRIVE" If this dose not open your eyes nothing will!!! I understand what you(JS)are stating, and do not mix facts with fiction, the world is not black and white. It is your choice to live the way you want as long as it is in the true light of love.. You appear to be well informed but, information does not denote Intelligence of Wisdom. I wish you all the love and luck on the path you have currently chosen.

you're*

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/59220.php
Why Vegetarians Are More Intelligent than Meat Eaters

Here is a couple articles linking HIGH IQ as a child to a vegetarian diet as an adult that you were asking about earlier. The one article does find an interesting correlation within the U.S. in that it is not as strong of a correlation between childhood IQ and becoming a vegetarian as an adult. Perhaps all that Jersey shore is rotting the brain? Or maybe it has become somewhat of a trend instead of an intelligently thought out choice because it is the moral the ethical way in which to eat. There is a long long list of people who made major advances in their various fields or were just plain smart people who were also known vegetarians. Extremely intelligent people. This list includes: Mark Twain, Leonardo Da Vinci, Plutarch, J.H. Kellogg, George Bernard Shaw, Albert Schweitzer, Pythagorus, Voltaire, Leo Tolstoy, Thorea, Gandhi, and Einstein. He became a vegetarian towards the last few years of his life and is quoted as saying "Nothing will benefit human health and increase chances for survival of life on Earth as much as the evolution to a vegetarian diet." Those are some people I am quite proud to share the same ideologies with. I like them understand when it comes to my diet and what I eat it isnt just about me. Society needs to stop thinking only of themselves because we are destroying ourselves and our planet. No other animals enslave, use and abuse another species the way we do, and we call ourselves superior. In what way? The fact that we can reason and understand these animals suffer so much for the sake of a taste of flesh is quite possibly the strongest case we have for the fact that we are not any better, or any more superior. Another quote from the brilliant man:

" A human being is a part of the whole, called by us the “Universe,” a part limited in time and space. He experiences himself, his thoughts and feelings, as something separate from the rest – a kind of optical delusion of his consciousness. This delusion is a kind of prison for us, restricting us to our personal desires and to affection for a few persons nearest to us. Our task must be to free ourselves from this prison by widening our circle of compassion to embrace all living creatures and the whole of nature in its beauty. Nobody is able to achieve this completely, but the striving for such achievement is in itself a part of the liberation and a foundation for inner security.
—Albert Einstein (1879–1955)

I think this is also the key for us advancing our society further than we have already. I will not argue that we started out as a tree dwelling monkey, and that it was eating meat that allowed us to evolve so that our brains could grow to the marvelous organ it is today, but now that we have reached this new level of thinking and awareness, I think it is our duty as a superior species to have mercy on those beings. For the sake of compassion and love and peace, I think it is well worth sacrificing our past flesh eating if it has the potential to eliminate murder and suffering and pain in more aspects of this world than just what the animals experience. If murdering an animal was looked upon by all as a true loss and sorrow and its life and soul given the reverence we as a society are completely void, then can you imagine those same people aiming a gun at each other? Throughout history very intelligent free thinking people all associated with peace have argued that vegetarianism is key to this world knowing peace. Isnt that what we all say we want? maybe its time to try something new, because for the millions of years that we have been eating meat and killing animals, we have also been slaughtering each other. To keep doing the same thing, but expect different results, that is the definition of insanity, yet we just keep on with our past ways. I think somebody inquired about you doing an article on the morality of the act of eating flesh, and noticed you left that one untouched. I think many people deep in their heart and soul feel it to be wrong, but just go along with the rest of the herd. Nobody can argue that people aren't immensely inclined to adopt whatever belief and idea of the culture they were brought up in. Reading the immense confidence in your scientific facts that its natural and healthy is all people need to cling to so that any of the feelings we may have had as children about killing things as wrong, to be silenced. But by continuing to partake in the murder and eating of sentient emotional beings with a desire to live and be free and perpetuating the slaughter of millions of animals, we will never live to see a day where we no longer slaughter and kill one another. We are desensitized, and have been told that it is just the way we are for as long as we can remember. There is far more propaganda out there for eating meat than for not eating meat, hence the fact it is so much more popular, and as you stated where even people claiming to be vegetarian do it. Those brilliant people listed above were able to hold firm in those beliefs that a vegetarian diet is essential for us as a society to progress into something new, something more beautiful and more full of love and enlightenment then we have ever been able to achieve. Perhaps following their advice for a just a few milleniums could be wise? We have tried the whole eating meat thing for millions, perhaps it has given us our big brains, and our fancy iphones, and rocket ships and satellites. But now that we have those things, maybe there is more we can achieve that isnt about how much fancy shit we can invent but how much love we can start putting out into this broken and fucked up world." The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man".—George Bernard Shaw. We have been adapting the world to ourselves since these "1300cc" brains you so much like to bring up like some superiority token. The fact is that these animals suffer so much, when we can live healthy without it. There is no love in the slaughter of another living being, justt because my brain is bigger, my right to live and be free should not also be greater. You and I are NOT more deserving of a free life because our brains managed to evolve faster. We live in a world that has "always" eaten meat as you say, and you are evidence we have always justified it, and stated it as natural, but maybe its not meant to be our way. Maybe we would have evolved anyways, but there is no way to test that now is there?
And again, even if eating meat is the reason we became the way we are, we don't have to continue doing it. Thats the beauty of being human, that we have the choice every time we sit down to eat. By what we have on our plate we are choosing to continue on the path we are on or to say that things can be different in our world, that we can live in a kinder more loving place. but things can't be different without loving and compassionate people willing to try something our species according to you has never done in order to achieve something our species has never been able to achieve before. A world of peace. I don't believe we will ever be there until we learn to respect the lives of animals on this planet the way we respect the lives of man. But one can argue we cant even figure out how to do that.

Maybe stop pigeon holing vegetarians for being stupid niave people with no concept of your "far superior" scientific facts about the history of flesh eating. Maybe just maybe, vegetarianism is the next step in our evolution to reaching our full potential in the moral capacity we are so dreadfully lacking. The list of people above, I'd consider them all brilliant, and some ahead of their times. I am happy to be among them, in the hopes that one day mankind will be able to let go of the archaic past of murder, pain and death and instead at one of kindness, love and compassion. But that's just me. End rant.

and you are entitled to think that we are funny. we are after all are the minority...that's to be expected. I believe it to be true there are a lot more vegetarians out there who have strived to better the world than meat eaters percentage wise. But I don't see how anybody else would be of your concern. And the list may not prove something but the research with High IQ and the choice to become a vegetarian as an adult is some evidence. Hitler was not actually a vegetarian, he loved stuffed pigeon, and ate sausage regularly. Not that it matters, there is going to be good and moral people in both categories, but I think the morality may be a little misguided on the meat eating side because we have been taught since we were children it is just how the world works, that animals die for our unnecessary pleasure to put their flesh in our mouths. Vegetarians are the ones questioning the status quo, as most of us abhor the killing of anything, and meat eaters seem to be a little more non-chalant about that sort of thing, which you helped support with a comment like this "Would world peace really be a good thing? How does it matter?"
It would matter a lot to the millions of families who are shipped the bodies of their sons, brothers and husbands home to bury. To the child who lost his dad, or to the children who are robbed of a childhood because they are forced to fight in a war they don't even understand, forced to murder other innocent people. I'd like to think we could do so much better, but it is impossible to change minds like yours, and that is why society will stay the way it is. Which is such a shame. And the quotes aren't pointless. This one still much applies and I will say it again. "The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man”.—George Bernard Shaw.
The people who are willing to adapt are stuck with most of the world's population who are not willing to adapt. We need to make some MAJOR changes in our values, and thoughts about what this life is all about, it sure isn't about inflicting pain and suffering on others for your own pleasure. There is no real humane way to slaughter an animal. The desire to live that exists in those millions of dogs own and loved in peoples homes is the same for every animal. We have laws to protect some animals but not others. Where do they divide the line between this animal isn't ok to torture but this one is? I know that the billions of people out there who eat meat aren't torturing animals, but they are supporting the torture of them when giving their money to a system that does because they like the way it tastes. In her book slaughterhouse, Gail Eisnitz, the chief investigator for the Humane Farming Association in the U.S. interviewed dozens of slaughterhouse workers throughout the country (which by the sounds of it is your country). In these interviews she found that every single one admitted to abusing animals or neglecting to report those who did. Some quotes from the workers of these interviews, "Hogs get stressed out pretty easy. If you prod them too much they have heart attacks. If you get a hog in a chute that's had the shit prodded out of him and has a heart attack or refuses to move, you take a meat hook and hook it into his bunghole [anus]. You're dragging these hogs alive, and a lot of the time the meat hook rips out of the bunghole. I've seen hams-thighs- completely ripped open, I've also seen intestines come out. If the hog collapses near the front of the chute, you shove the meat hook into his cheek and drag him forward." Another one "pigs on the kill floor have come up and nuzzled me like a puppy. Two minutes later I had to kill them - beat them to death with a pipe" These stories by real workers, from real slaughterhouses go on and on and on. Eisnitz chronicled the constant failure of U.S. Deptarment of Agriculture inspectors to stop this abuse and their willingness to look the other way. And of course they would, because I am sure they don't have their first choice in workers for those kinds of conditions. Who would want to do that job? Nobody, but they don't have to think about it at all when they go to the store to see the neat and tidy slab of meat for their christmas dinner.
Personally, I don't believe anyone should allow that to happen, but we live in a society that does allow it to happen, every...single...day. So knowing I can get all the nutrients I need without putting an innocent creature through that kind of horror makes it impossible for me to condone that kind of torture. The only real way to take a stand is to refuse to participate. By supporting the industry that does it, you might as well be the one in the room doing those terrible things. Pigs have been shown to have intelligence that exceeds a three year old child. It's not ok to do that to a three year old child, yet we condone it with a pig because its "just an animal".
I am not ok with that. That doesn't make sense to me, but I am sure somehow you are able to make it work for you. But that is the different frame of mind that sets you and I apart, and I will always be proud of that distinction. My reverence and respect for life and yours are just plain and simple...different.
It's not about a been there done that kind of trend that you are suggesting so many people will relay to me that it was for them. Most vegetarians don't view inhumane torture as something you move on from because its plain and simple wrong. I believe you don't think about vegetarians at all, you don't think much about anyone else but yourself.

Lastly, thank you for correcting my grammar, you may have noticed I had already done that. You didn't notice however that I left my typo of the word naive, because this is an internet forum, not a thesis paper. But just in case. Naive* 😉